In Episode 529 of Fishing Without Bait, behavioral health therapist Jim Ellermeyer sits down with Producer Mike for a return to the fundamental ideas that have shaped the podcast through more than 500 episodes.

At the center of the conversation is a simple relationship between expectations and serenity:

“The greater your expectations, the lower your serenity. The lower your expectations, the greater your serenity.”

Jim and Mike explore the difference between setting rigid expectations and setting intentions. An expectation can turn life into a pass/fail exercise where anything short of a particular outcome feels like failure. An intention gives us direction while allowing us to remain present, curious, and responsive to what actually happens.

That leads to another question Mike asks himself: “What am I working so hard to get to?”

Jim's answer is equally simple: “There is no there.”

The conversation expands into emotional honesty and the ways people avoid uncomfortable truths. Jim challenges the automatic response of telling everyone we're “good” when we aren't—including situations where honesty with doctors, loved ones, recovery peers, or ourselves could make a meaningful difference.

They also discuss the 12-step idea that “it's our secrets that keep us sick,” the discomfort involved in confronting fears and resentments, and the tendency to keep “kicking the emotional can down the road” instead of dealing with what is immediately in front of us.

Mindfulness, as Jim and Mike describe it, isn't escaping daily life or spending hours in meditation. It is practical:

Paying attention on purpose.

It's pausing before reacting. Questioning assumptions. Making choices based on facts instead of beliefs. Recognizing how our words and actions affect others. And allowing our words to pass through three important gates:

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

The episode closes by returning to impermanence and non-attachment. Everything and everyone in our lives is shared with us temporarily. Rather than making life meaningless, that understanding can make the present more valuable.

We don't live by years, months, weeks, days, or hours.

We live by moments.

Make this one count.

Continue the Journey

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Missy and Jim Ellermeyer begin by examining the complicated realities surrounding abortion and the question of what happens after a child is born. Their conversation moves beyond political slogans to consider infertility, adoption, foster care, support systems, special-needs care, financial responsibility, and the difficult decisions families may face.

Missy shares personal experiences that have shaped her perspective, including going through infertility treatments and seeing family members navigate teenage pregnancy and lifelong care needs. The discussion asks whether society is doing enough to educate young people about consequences, critical thinking, emotional decision-making, and personal responsibility.

The conversation then expands into voter education and representative government. Drawing from her work as a Republican committee woman and her experiences at polling locations, Missy discusses the importance of understanding what elected offices actually control rather than voting entirely through party labels or a single issue.

Jim and Missy also consider how political representatives can become disconnected from their constituents, how social media encourages echo chambers, and why people often listen only long enough to prepare their response.

Despite the disagreements and difficult subjects, the episode returns to a simple principle: people should be treated with courtesy and respect. Meaningful progress begins when we stop reducing one another to political labels and begin listening to learn.

This is Part 2 of our conversation with Missy Sorg. The discussion continues in the next episode.

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Support the podcast and receive ad-free episodes through Patreon:
https://www.patreon.com/c/fishingwithoutbait

Pick up Learn to Fish Without Bait: A 365-Day Mindfulness Journal and Adult Coloring Book:
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Do a kindness for yourself. Do a kindness for another. Forgive yourself and forgive another.

Missy shares why she wanted to return to the show and talk openly about strained friendships, lost connections, and the fear of being reduced to a political label. Jim and Missy explore the idea that even when people disagree, there may still be a shared “ice cream” — a common point of connection that allows a real conversation to begin.

This Part 1 episode moves through themes of political polarization, patriotism, social media, assumptions, “contempt prior to investigation,” and the need to focus less on identifying problems and more on finding solutions. Missy also opens up about women’s health, fertility treatments, abortion, birth control, and the way women’s bodies are often discussed or legislated without enough listening or understanding.

Rather than a shouting match, this is a conversation about conversation itself: how to disagree without dehumanizing, how to listen without surrendering your values, and how to look for the person behind the label.

Subscribe to Fishing Without Bait on your favorite podcast player. Support the show and receive ad-free episodes on Patreon at https://www.patreon.com/c/fishingwithoutbait. You can also pick up our book, “Learn to Fish Without Bait: A 365-Day Mindfulness Journal and Adult Coloring Book,” at https://www.lulu.com/shop/james-ellermeyer-lpc-ma-ncc-lpc/learn-to-fish-without-bait/paperback/product-6n9rd8.html?page=1&pageSize=4